Oh No, Poor Joe (Joe the Plumber Meets the Ghost of Joe McCarthy)

~~Posted by kenosha Marage

I don’t know if any of you ever saw the movie Dave with Kevin Kline and Sigourney Weaver but there is a scene where a teacher at a day care center is doing a teaching/game with some kids. The game uses the phrase “Oh No, Poor Joe” and then goes on with a choice for the kids about whatever poor Joe’s problem happens to be.

I was reminded of that scene in the movie by the battering of Poor Joe the Plumber. Oh No, Poor Joe had the audacity to ask a question of a presidential candidate and now the candidates campaign, the media and the left shrilloshere are relentlessly attempting to destroy him. Oh No, Poor Joe, has now had his personal life turned upside down and inside out and his personal information posted on toxic waste dumps like the Daily K.

Why would any decent citizen, Democrat, Republican, Green, Independent or whatever excoriate another citizen for the crime of asking a question of someone who is asking us to vote for him for highest office in our country? Seems to me that we should all be asking both candidate lots of questions. Seems to me Obama should be explaining why citizens aren’t allowed to ask questions without being attacked by his surrogates.

Isn’t the left supposed to be all about fighting for and supporting the little guys and gals? If not, and it seems not, then I’ve been voting for the wrong party for a very long time. However that would mean that I thought this Democratic Party was the same Democratic Party I used to support. This Democratic Party has had an Extreme Makeover and the makeover has distorted every thing for which it ever stood.

The trials and tribulations of Poor Joe the Plumber is a microcosm of what is happening in this country courtesy of Obama, the beyond-biased-in-his-favor media and the disgusting cesspool that many left-leaning Blogs have become.

Are we resurrecting the ghost of McCarthyism? Oh No, not Joe (Joseph McCarthy) coming to our politics once again. Do we never learn that stifling someone’s free speech stifles all free speech?

How long did it take the media back in the 1950’s to remember their job was to inform the public of the truth? How long did the congress allow one drunken, lunatic of a Senator to hold the country hostage to his relentless witch-hunts? How many lives had to be destroyed before one courageous Journalist spoke out? That a lunatic like Keith Olbermann dares to use Edward R. Murrow’s tag line is criminal. Thugs like Olbermann attack people as “racist” the way McCarthy attacked them as “communist”.

Is it now standard operating procedure that a politician is allowed to use the tactics of personal destruction against a citizen that dares ask him a question? Perhaps questions are only permitted if the questioner nods their head in agreement with his answer. How un-American is that attitude? How un-democratic is that attitude? How does that connect to the ballyhoo we Americans make about believing in freedom of speech?

I see nothing wrong in supporting the candidate of your choice. I supported mine, her own party sandbagged her and I have moved on. But I never hung on her every word or thought she was the 8th Wonder of the World. I would not have thought of attacking someone for the crime of asking her a question and then not agreeing with the answer. Disagreeing with others is what many of us spend most of our lives doing. It’s the American Way. It’s the human way.

Anyone that worships any politician is living in a fantasyland. Politicians lie for a living. They have to lie. If they stood up and told the public the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth they wouldn’t be elected to the city council in a one-horse town. Even in towns smaller than Wasilla, AL.

So pardon Poor Joe and Josephine the average American for thinking they have a right to question someone running for president. Pardon Poor Joe and Josephine for not getting in line, climbing on the bandwagon or marching in lockstep. Pardon them for believing that they have the right and the freedom to both disagree and be disagreeable. No matter who the candidate may be. Never forget these candidates are asking to work for us, and are supposed to represent us. Wouldn’t it be nice if things actually worked that way?

If you think Poor Joe the Plumber should not have the right to ask his questions, disagree with the answer and then be left in peace then you are not a liberal, a progressive or a Democrat. You don’t believe in the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution or the freedoms they assert.

You are of that pack of Americans called Obamacrats and we’ve all ready seen how little regard you have for freedom, honesty and fairness. Members of a cult seldom do.

We’ve seen the right behave like this in the past and we were appalled. That kind of repulsive behavior had us looking for the tar and feathers. Too bad we don’t feel the same way now. It is not encouraging to find that the liberals are every bit as big on hypocrisy as the conservatives. One wonders where to go.

“Oh waiter, can I have a table for a party of one?” However, I do expect company later. Lot’s of company.

40 Responses

  1. Poor honest Joe is being mocked by liberal media after conservative ones promoted him into an instant public hero and after a broad public acknowledged that he either wasn’t all that honest or all that poor. How very American is that?

  2. Axel, Axel, poor baby, are you sure you got all your Obama talking points in that one post? Don’t you want to go and find some more that justify the Obama campaign and mainstream media demonizing a private citizen for simply asking a question?

    Is it only people who have absolutely no faults in all the world who are allowed to ask questions? His honesty or bank account is not the problem. The problem is not allowing people to ask questions. The problem is that if they do not simply nod their head when the “One” and his surrogates speak they are savaged. But you knew that when you commented.

    Run along Axel, I have all ready wasted far more time on you than you are worth. I said what I said because it is what I believe. Not interested in what you believe.

  3. i’ve been thinking about the “tome” linked to yesterday.
    The one about “Obama’s use of hypnotic techniques”. Then I thought abut us “old, bitter, gun-toting, Bible thumping, (former) base of the Democratic party”. We know who we are.

    We’ve been sweet talked, harrassed, manipulated, overlooked, pushed aside, pulled apart so that someone (father, teacher, brother, boyfriend, girlfriend, boss, professor, neighbor, cop, minister, priest, alderman, candidate, etc) could get what s/he wanted.
    That’s why we don’t listen to the “smooth talking’
    One who is empty of substance, (but never mind that) yet wants us to give him the highest seat in government and (perhaps) the most powerful position in the world. (notice I didn’t say the free world In a free world, Joe wouldn’t have been the subject/object of the mockery and scorn. nor would he have had his personal information become public.)

    These Obamobots don’t have the wisdom to know what they are doing, nor what they are getting us into. They don’t have the defenses that people of wisdom and experience have to stave off this onslaught of nothingness.

    And yes, Axel, I mean you and yours. If you had real smarts, you would be able to look beyond the words (just words) that this man utters, and see that there’s no there, there.

  4. kenoshamarge,

    I’ve been eating at a table for 1 for quite some time now, and it’s nice to finally have so many people to talk to!

    The American political system and the 2 major parties have been dreadfully corrupt for my entire life. Ironically, the last truly good President we had, FDR, would never get past the media vetting that’s done of only honest people. “He lied about his health!” they would cry, or “He’s a cripple – he’s not one of us!”.

    Pffft.

    They all have to go. The politicians, the parties, the system, and the media. I think that regardless of where you stand politically, you have to be at least a little bit in agreement with that statement.

  5. …and marge, Dave is one of my favorite movies – I’ve seen it more times than I’m willing to admit. Thanks for the remindre. And that scene in the homeless shelter is a classic.

    But now the “poor Joes” are those who “have no eyes” to see the fraud that is being perpetrated on us. And the poor Joes “have no ears” to actually hear what isn’t being said. And some of them actually “have no brains” to really figure out what is actually happening here.
    I stopped watching Olbermann in January. And I never watched Tweety ,after seeing him on other programs.
    I haven’t missed MSNBO for a second. It gives me more time to think for myself.

    (/ rant)

  6. Rant on Leslie! You speak for many of us. We old bitter enders that refuse to give in, give up and follow the “star” of some damn slick-talking politician.

    And Grail has it right, it’s time for some very serious house-cleaning in our government. There is a foul stench emanating from our nation’s capital and it’s time, and long past time, we got rid of it.

    If all of us who are quietly sitting at our table for one got together there isn’t a table big enough in all the world to hold us. And if we don’t give-up or give-in there isn’t anything that can stop us.

  7. You coined it! That’s so true! “Racist” is the new “communist”! The white scare replaced the red scare!

  8. axel
    Should only Obama approved voters be allowed to ask questions?
    Maybe, only them be allowed to vote? Because, let me remind you, it was Obama traveling to Joe’s home, not Joe stalking Obama. Why pretend you care about people’s opinions, when it’s clear a photo opportunity was all that was sought? At least W waited to be installed in the White House before he became the Boy in the Bubble.

  9. i have never witnessed this kind of politics except in india and pakistan.

    the hundreds of millions spent on running for office to grab power speaks volumes for the level of power one attains;

    the world is not getting to be a better place.

  10. Great post Marge! It is sickening to see these so called liberals trying to quell free speech and attack ruthlessly with no regard for anything or anyone but their idiot messiah. They will say or do anything to justify and even praise the most vile behaviour!

    It’s all about class warfare and age warfare. On uor side it’s got to be all about reform and returning to basic principals.

    CQ

  11. These people aren’t liberals and they aren’t really Democrats. The care about one thing and one thing only and that’s Obama. Thus the Obamacrats can do anything they want to “us” because we are the enemy.

    Otherwise rational people in churches across the world believe that people that don’t believe in religion the way “they” believe are doomed to eternal damnation. Some loving father that is! But they believe it and evidently approve of it.

    That is exactly the mindset of the Obamacrats. Amazing how many ordinarily cynical people have caught the Obamavirus.

    How long before it is suggested that the rest of us should be burned at the stake for “daring” not to believe. History tells us that “true” believers are capable of anything.

  12. EdgeofForever: You coined it! That’s so true! “Racist” is the new “communist”! The white scare replaced the red scare!

    You said it!
    The Whites were just as bad if not worse than the Reds in the Russian Revolution. Both were just as corrupt, vicious, and brutal. Ever read “Doctor Zhivago”?

    The attack on Joe the Plumber is especially frightening when its put in context with other maneuvers by the Obamacrats. The Texan women who had a visit by the Secret Service because she was “rude” to an Obama supporter who had called her on her cellphone, and their was no recording or any evidence that she even made a death threat; just the accusation of the Obama supporter. The truth squads in MO that have incorporated sheriffs to stop the lies people say about Obama. Republicans who found they had fraudulent charges to the Obama campaign on their charge cards. …

    It’s the sum of these actions that is deeply frightening indeed.

    What more could convince people that just speaking out against Obama is far more dangerous than they could ever conceive?

  13. […] Ironically, the McCarthy-sm of this campaign and its media already replaced “communist” with racist&#822… […]

  14. “If you think Poor Joe the Plumber should not have the right to ask his questions, disagree with the answer and then be left in peace then you are not a liberal, a progressive or a Democrat”

    Marge,
    Left in peace? It seems to me that the one most responsible for not leaving Joe “in peace” is John McCain, the candidate who grabbed up Joe’s name, image and concerns to be placed front and center in his campaign. With cable news media close behind.

    Jesse Katrencik

  15. Jesse,

    I disagree. It was Obama supporters (including the Obamedia) that did the digging into Joe’s life, not McCain. There have been numerous other people cited by the candidates at debates since the primaries, but not one of them has been torn apart like this.

  16. That is the perfect antidote for this, the new McCarthyism. Today I heard that the term socialism has been deemed racist, and someone asked if the Constitution was next. Eventually, even that can be called racist as it is a document of the white power structure of oppression. With the help of your definition, maybe we can take the shortcut to the end of this nonsense.

  17. Perhaps having a MSM digging for dirt in your life is not being left in peace?

    Did John McCain attack an ordinary citizen? Did John McCain try to find any nasty little tidbit about and ordinary citizen in order to make an Obama point?

    Did Obama and Biden both sneer at Joe the Plumber and say they didn’t know any plumbers that made $250,000.00 when that isn’t what Joe said at all.

    Being an Obamabot is really hard work isn’t it? You have to take facts and twist and turn them until they say what you want them to say. Much easier to just say what really happened.

    Go away Jesse, trolls and liars aren’t well received here.

  18. Another movie about another president, stars Michael Douglas. And in it he says “Rumson says he loves America. But he can’t stand Americans”

    I think if we substitute the name Obama for Rumson,
    we’ll have a worthy quote.

    Under-the-bus is quite crowded with the Americans Obama threw there. Many quite amazing people imo. While some of them were tossed there with little or no apparent reason other than they were supporting (“you’re likeable enough”) Hillary Clinton, others (Rev Wright, Micheal Pfleger, Antoin Rezko) took longer. They didn’t get thrown away until they became obvious albatross hanging on Teh One’s neck. Then came Joe The Plumber. He was invited to ask a question. The problem became one that Obama had been ducking all along. It was a real question. And he wanted a real answer. Not the “Hope in me, I’m the Change you’ve been Waiting for” kind of response Teh Precious always has at his disposal.

    Not only did this guy get thrown under the bus, but Obama and his bots made darn certain that bus would run over him several times.

    So Obama says he loves America. But he clearly doesn’t like Americans.

  19. Well said Leslie, very well said. And to carry you point even further, I don’t think the elite leadership of either of the major political parties like Americans either.

    Perhaps that’s why the media keeps hammering McCain/Palin and the Republican party and even most of right wing media doesn’t spring to his defence.

    Says to me that they turn their noses up at McCain/Palin for the same reason they turn their exfoliated noses up at us.

  20. Leslie & Marge

    Well said! No use for us at all…

    And I believe the movie is The American President.

  21. You are absolutely correct, Grail G,
    the movie is indeed The American President”.

    Some of the best lines (and true lines). 😉

  22. Grail and Marge,
    Well of COURSE they’re going to dig into his life after he was put up on a pedestal by McCain. That’s their job. Did CNN espose more dirt than FOX in this case? Of course, what would you expect? Joe seems to be taking it in stride, even enjoying it, and has stated he does not blame Obama for his situation. Even considering a run for congress. The worst thing i heard about him was that he thinks Alan Colmes is hilarious (from an interview with Laura Ingraham) but then again I am not permanently tuned into the cable news cesspool.

    From what i heard of Joe’s question, it seemed that Joe was talking about a business making more than 250,000 and Obama was talking about a family making more than 250,000. Seems like apples an oranges to me and maybe thats what Obama’s answer should’ve stressed. But Obama did leave poor Joe in peace after his question.

    As far as your charming invitation to scram, don’t think that will happen. You are in charge of the site, so block me if you’d like. But i can’t let some of the nonsense here go unchallenged. It came down to either replying to your comments or marking a big lipstick “M” on my face and claiming I was attacked by a crazed gaggle of racist Pumas at the ATM. Tough choice for a card carrying member of the Oborg, you say? Nope.

    Troll? Well, I know yinz are into name calling and i can’t stop that, but Liar, Marge? Do tell.

    Jesse Katrencik

  23. Jesse,

    Yes, that’s the way things work in a fascist regime, isn’t it? Hope you’re this chipper when it’s your or one of your family members being raked over the coals!

    XOXOXO!

  24. And just for kicks, Jesse, why don’t you check this out:

    http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/25/report-government-computers-used-information-joe-plumber/

    Seems the muckraking on Joe wasn’t anything near “run of the mill”…

  25. Jesse,

    I’ve all ready wasted more time with you than you are worth. Just understand this, I have no interest in anything anyone who supports Obama has to say. EVER! I dislike him to the depth of my being.

    Yes you are a liar. You spread you lies from one end of the net to the other on anti-Obama sites. Some may call it spin or misinformed, I call it like I see it. You, just like your reprehensible candidate, lie.

    Obama may become president. God knows the media and the idiots like you are doing your best to shove him down our throats. Whatever happens, Obama will never, ever, be MY president just like George W. Bush never was MY president. I will loathe them both to the day I die.

    Yesterday I voted for McCain/Palin, the first time in a long life that I had ever voted for a Republican. It felt good. I put my principals and my country before any damn party.

    Just go away Jesse. WE don’t care what you think and we don’t care what you have to say. In my eyes, and speaking just for me you are a rude, boorish fool, who insists on shoving himself forward where he isn’t wanted. Trollish behavior? Yes. Liar, yes. Name calling? You Betcha!

    This is the last time I waste time with you. Go away little troll.

  26. Thanks, GG.
    I appreciate knowing that Teh One is no better – and yes, mayber even worse that GWB. (That has been my belief since day 2 – worse than bush.) And this abuse of power is just the tip of the p.o.s.

    This is what I just wrote at MountainSage:
    “I believe obama is a liar. I believe he has scammed his way (with the backing of some like minded liars and thieves) to this position (nominee). I believe pigs – even pigs with lipstick – will fly over my house before he tells the truth. or Before anyone else (MSM, DNC) will tell the truth about him.

    There have been many times in the past 8 years when I have been ashamed to call myself an American. But I was never ashamed to call myself a Democrat until the past year. “

    My mantra has become:

    “I’d rather be proven wrong about Obama than proven to be right.”

    Thanks again GG. You spoke for me long before I knew you spoke for me.

  27. Oh, The American President is one of my favorites…I have that last press conference speech recorded!!! It was written, by the way, by the guy who wrote “The West Wing”…before that hit the TV airwaves…

  28. Dear Readers—do you want me to block Jesse? I don’t know how to, by the way.
    I have no problem with hearing his stuff…I don’t bother to reply most of the time…Obamacrats are set in stone and are in denial. It’s interesting to find out what their latest rationalization. At least Jesse hasn’t threatened anyone and is civil.

  29. I don’t much care if you block him or not. I just don’t intend to respond to him again.

    I said all I had to say about him and his kind above. Personally I find that he adds nothing to the conversation and is a total waste of space.

    I’m sorry I wasted space here responding to him Grl, it will not happen again.

  30. GRL,

    I think we’ve hit the bigtime! While Jesse was our first bonafide troll, it looks like we’ve got a couple more joining us in the form of Pagan Power’s Captainkickstand and our new “friend” from Brobot Internationale. Woo hoo! Who knew we were so important? Maybe we can become really big like No Quarter and have more trolls than posters…

    If you want to block the bots, drop me a line.

  31. Sometimes the trolls are amusing with their talking points and non-thinking posts. Sometimes they are not (amusing). Unless they become abusive, I don’t care whether they are here or elsewhere. It’s still your site, though, and it truly is up to you. 😉

    I’m with GG in her assessment: “Who knew we were so important?”

  32. Look, Margie… I don’t want to burst your bubble, but if you honestly think i am some power-posting obama troll attacking every anti-obama site i can find you are mistaken. You can’t accomplish anything unless you choose your battles and your site is the one i chose. I found it by accident a few months ago, was disturbed by some of the frankly retarded sentiments (through both articles and comments) and decided to speak up about it. Like you, just trying to make a difference.

    I don’t visit or comment on any other political blogs, except for the occasional link emailed to me. Checked out CQ’s site (as a link from yours) a few times but wasn’t smitten. I post using my real name to assure you that I am NOT a personal threat to anyone and am not posting attacks on multple sites under different cutesie coward names.

    Showing myself when i’m not wanted? How very patriarchal of you, Marge. Fuhrer Obama would be proud of you. And I like this “not having a president” thing you’ve got going. Very maverick-y. You are truly brave, Marge. If that is your real name.

    Jesse Katrencik

  33. Jesse,

    It’s been a long, hard, bitter battle for the last 2 full years. I do understand your point, but you also need to consider this: Marge (and yes, that is her real name) has been blogging for a very long time. She has commented on many sites where trolls have swarmed and attacked strictly for the purpose of distracting from the point of the article.

    I understand that you are not the typical “power-posting obama troll attacking every anti-obama site”, but if you have ever visited sites like No Quarter or Bitter Politcz (that was harassed so much they became an invitation-only site) you would realize that at times you do tend to come off like one of these people in your comments (usually when you are angry). Just as I am sure there are times when we come off as a stereotype to you (usually when we are angry).

    I guess my real point is this: In 2 weeks +/-, the election will be over. We will be dealing with an entirely new reality, no matter who wins. All of our worlds are going to be rocked, the economy will continue to suffer, and the international community will have a response that is entirely out of our control. We will all be changed, and we will have to live with each other. Roughly half of America will be severely disappointed in their political cohorts, and mad as hell.

    We all have to make a choice. Are we going to follow the example of historical figures like Ghandi, Yeshua, Buddha, etc. and forgive each other for being and thinking different? Or are we going to follow those that would incite us to hate each other and become bitter, resentful, and self-loathing?

    I would like to suggest to both you and Marge that we call it even and admit that we’ve all (myself included) posted things in haste that we might like to take back. Let’s agree to disagree. I know I’m not likely to change your opinion politically, and I suspect you know you’re not going to change mine or Marge’s. I don’t want GRL to ban you from this site. You are generally respectful, and you often make make me stop and think. That makes you a contributor, even if I don’t agree with you or you reasons for being here. I extend the same thought to “brotherkomrade”, even though he has done the cutsie name thing, because he does offer a different viewpoint (even if he does tend to express it in a less than delightful way at times). I do not offer this sentiment to the people that show up here for no other purpose than to harrass and offend (although they generally leave after they drop their bombs).

    In that spirit, I would like to make a gesture of civility and apologize to you for anything I may have said or written that you found personally offensive. I cannot of course do so for Marge or anyone else, but would encourage everyone to take a moment and try to separate the opinions from the human being and act accordingly. This is still America, and we are all in this together. Even if we disagree.

  34. thanks, GG and Jesse, too.

    I am certain that I have said things (I surely have thought them) that were uncivilized at best. And I, too believe that no matter what happens on Nov 4 we are still all in this together. And we can make it work or we can work to make it better. (after all, look what we have survived for the past 8 years.)

    And thank you to GRL for providing this place where we can meet and share our thoughts and feel safe at the same time. And Marge for your wicked bad self. The times are much more tolerable when you are writing.

  35. Ladies (not said sarcastically),
    Although I appreciate your willingness to apologize, that’s certainly not what i’m looking for. I’m not offended in a personal way by any comments made here, at least pertaining to obama and his supporters. I’m not looking for any kind of kumbay-ya moment between us. Just a clearer means of communication.

    These Obama-bot type portrayals that pepper this place just don’t fly with me. OK, i don’t have the blogging experience to back it up, but It seems like there’s about 100 brash annoying people harassing you who are not willing to admit any fault in their candidate. Your (as a group) consequent Limbaugh/Rove-style labeling of EVERY other obama supporter as an un-thinking bot takes away from any reasoned argument you try to make. I plan on voting for Obama, yet i don’t know ANYone who would be described as blindly supporting him. Every obama supporter i know supports him with some reservations, whether concerns about his youth, inexperience, taxes, middle name, race, muslim heritage, not being Hillary, etc.

    The general Manchurian Candidate paranoia about Obama on this site disturbs me more, but there’s too much to go into point by point right now. Oh well, guess I’ll have to go elsewhere to peddle my petition to give John Murtha the presidential medal of freedom.

    A place named Bitter Politicz was harassed? Go figure.

    And yes, i figured Marge was her real name, just kidding there.

    Thanks for your time,

    Jesse Katrencik

  36. Margie? Enough said isn’t it Jessie? Go away troll.

  37. And FYI folks, when you keep responding to creeps like Jessie you allow him to hi-jack the post and it becomes all about him which is what he intended in the first place.

    By continuing a dialogue with him you help him. he wins, you loose and he has done his work. Ignore him and those like him. They aren’t worth your time or effort and intent of the post is lost.

  38. Jesse,

    I think you just proved the validity of lumping you all together.

    It’s ok, though. I’d rather extend an olive branch to someone that didn’t deserve it than to blow off someone who deserved better. I have done this many times on various blogs and almost always end up providing a forum for people to show themselves as the narrow-minded people they pretend not to be in their self-righteous comments.

    Thanks for not ruining the Bell Curve.

  39. You don’t believe in the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution or the freedoms they assert.
    …………….

    AMEN! When they attack the citizens for just asking a question (like Joe the Plumber) or for dissent (like us PUMAs) they have totally lost the plot and what a FREE society is all about.

  40. Got it:
    Don’t attack citizens for questioning or dissenting but if you continue a dialog with them, they win and you lose. Ignore them and they’ll go away.

    Now…I…am…starting…to…understand…

    I…will…now…go…buy…a…Joe…The…Plumber…t-shirt…

    I…am…no…longer…an …Obama-bot…everything…is…ok…now…after…a…little…hypnosis….session…

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